New mailing list

[Barbara Ann Klein <baklein@ibm.net>]

Could you guys start a different mailing list?  Let's get back on topic here,
PUH-LEEZE!

Barbara

Matt Waggoner wrote:

> You've fallen into what I call the Cultural Fallacy.  It basically states
> that you are assuming in your statements below that things like apartheid
> and torture are inherently wrong, when in reality, it's only your belief
> system that makes them wrong.  And that's fine!  I think they're wrong,
> too.  But nothing is inherently wrong, or inherently anything, for that
> matter.
>
> Now that aside, I am not saying that we should simply allow things that we
> consider unjustices to continue -- but the problem becomes, when does it
> cross the (very fine) line from being a morally righteous issue, to
> something that is merely you trying to make people do what you want?  (I
> use "you" in the general sense.)
>
> You haven't explicitly said that women SHOULD be allowed on the dohyo, but
> I take it from the general tilt of your statements that you do lean in that
> direction.  I, for the most part, believe that women should not be allowed
> to touch the dohyo, but not because I think women are unclean or anything
> like that.  It is, as I stated before, because it would disrupt everyone's
> enjoyment of sumo.  Since my personal goal is to enjoy sumo, and since a
> woman touching the dohyo will prevent that, well... sorry, women, but I
> think stasis wins in this scenario.
>
> At 10:28 5/31/99 -0500, sjm wrote:
> >
> >Sorry you feel that way, but arguments such as yours are commonly
> >used to justify oppression all over the globe.  South Africa had the
> >"culture" of apartheid.  China has the "culture" of torturing its
> >prisoners.  So I don't see "it's their culture" as a valid argument
> >at all.  It used to be part of Western culture to own slaves.  Aren't
> >we glad we got rid of that cultural artifact?
> >
> >Sten
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: Russell Starkey <russtar@hotmail.com>
> >To: sumo@brooks.statgen.ncsu.edu <sumo@brooks.statgen.ncsu.edu>
> >Date: Monday, May 31, 1999 3:20 AM
> >Subject: Re: bjewell@twics.com
> >
> >
> >>It is a sad but true comment on Western culture that too many of us don't
> >>seem to be able to see other cultures from the point of veiw of the people
> >>who live in them rather than veiwing other cultures and traditions as
> >>somehow "wrong" because they differ from our own.
> >>
> >>I veiw your statement as almost as bad a slur as the one about Manny
> >>Yarbrough that was posted last week.
> >>
> >>The more I read some of the comment that appear on this ML the more I find
> >>myself just shaking my head in wonderment.
> >>
> >>Russ
> >>
> >>
> >>_______________________________________________________________
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> >
> >
> >
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> | Matt Waggoner - http://www.seas.ucla.edu/~waggoner
> | "Before you criticize a man, walk a mile in his shoes.
> | Then, when you criticize him, he's a mile away and has no shoes."